The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Wednesday 30th September) - Trafford keeps a clean sheet as England beat 10 man Czechia

[Ellandback1]

Good Morning. It's Wednesday 30th September, and here are the latest headlines from Elland Road...

Trafford keeps a clean sheet as England beat 10-man Czechia in Prague

James Trafford produced a composed display as England beat Czechia 2-0 in Prague to record their first UEFA Nations League win of the campaign. The Leeds shot-stopper started again ahead of Jordan Pickford and left Fortuna Arena with a clean sheet after second-half goals from Anthony Gordon and Harry Kane. Pavel Šulc’s 25th-minute red card made it a quieter night than it first threatened to be, but Trafford still did the important parts well. Czechia began brightly.

Inside the opening five minutes a defensive slip allowed Šulc through, only for Trafford to come off his line and smother the chance. Lukáš Červ then volleyed wide. England were still finding their rhythm when Šulc’s high challenge on Elliot Anderson was upgraded from yellow to red after a VAR review. From there the visitors controlled more of the ball. Trafford’s distribution was a feature of that spell, as England built from the back under Thomas Tuchel. The deadlock lasted until two minutes after the restart, when Trent Alexander-Arnold’s cross was headed in by Gordon.

Kane swept in the second in the 69th minute for his 87th England goal. Trafford later made another firm stop as Czechia briefly broke forward, protecting the two-goal lead. Sky Sports rated Trafford a 7. It was not a night that demanded a string of spectacular saves, but it was the sort of away performance goalkeepers are judged on: early bravery, clean handling, and no drama's. Whether that is enough to put real pressure on Pickford is another question. Tuchel has now trusted Trafford in consecutive Nations League games, but ousting an established first-choice still takes more than one tidy night in Prague.

Leeds could be due over £10m in MCFC settlement

Leeds United could theoretically be due more than £10 million from Manchester City but the figure is a starting point, not a cheque. A calculation circulated this week put Leeds United’s potential share of redistributed Premier League prize money at a minimum of about £10.3 million if Manchester City’s league positions from 2011/12 onwards were stripped out of the table. The number comes from an OLBG model of merit payments and was highlighted by Leeds Live. Combined across every club that appeared in the Premier League over that span, the same exercise produces a headline total of roughly £528 million.

That should not be confused with a confirmed payout. It is a paper exercise: take City out of the finishing order, move every club below them up one place, and recalculate the merit payments that flow from league position. Leeds’ modelled uplift is £10,297,033. Other clubs that spent far more seasons in the top flight over the period come out far higher, Everton and Manchester United are both in the high-£20 millions on the same measure. The figure could grow if a club could prove that City’s financial breaches also cost it European qualification, extra broadcast or commercial income, or other knock-on revenue.

Those claims are possible in principle under Premier League Rule W, which allows compensation “unlimited in amount” where loss can be shown. They are also much harder to evidence than a simple merit-payment spreadsheet. The independent commission’s findings relate to the period 2009–2018. Leeds were not a Premier League club for any of those seasons. They were promoted in 2020. Several analyses therefore treat Leeds as a weaker claimant than sides that finished immediately behind City during the charged years. Leeds would likely have to argue a more indirect case: that an unfair advantage built between 2009 and 2018 still distorted the table after they returned to the top flight.

That is a steeper hill than the one facing Manchester United, Arsenal or Everton. City have indicated they will appeal, and they will probably drag it out. Compensation claims would normally wait until that process is finished; Even then each club would have to bring, and fund its own case and prove causation, not just point to a modelled spreadsheet. Precedent exists; the Burnley–Everton compensation case showed that a club can recover substantial sums when it can demonstrate that another side’s financial breach changed its sporting outcome. Leeds themselves previously reached a private settlement with Everton over an earlier PSR issue.

Those examples matter, but they do not create an automatic rebate for every club that ever finished below City. The £10.3 million number is therefore best read as an illustration of how prize money would shift if City were simply deleted from the table. Turning it into money in Leeds’ accounts would require a final upheld verdict, a successful causation argument covering seasons after 2018, and a commission or court willing to award it. None of that has happened yet.

Crew settling in well at Walsall

Leeds United midfielder Charlie Crew was named in the Wales Under-21 starting eleven as Matty Jones’ side lost 1-0 to Belgium Under-21s in Westerlo on Tuesday night. The UEFA Euro 2027 qualifier was played at Het Kuipje and settled by a single early goal. Coventry City forward Norman Bassette, on loan at hosts KVC Westerlo, scored after seven minutes, finishing from close range after Romeo Vermant’s assist. Wales’ task became harder just before half-time when defender Dan Cox was sent off by referee Jan Všetečka for a second yellow card. Reduced to 10 men, the young Dragons still produced a determined second-half display and prevented Belgium from adding to their lead.

Crew, 20, started in midfield and played through the contest. The Cardiff-born defensive midfielder is currently on a season-long loan at League Two side Walsall from Leeds and has featured regularly for the Saddlers in league and cup this term. He already has senior Wales caps and has become a regular at Under-21 level under Jones, a former Leeds player. The result continues a difficult qualifying campaign against one of the group’s strongest sides. Wales host Austria at The Oval in Caernarfon next Tuesday as they look to finish the campaign on a stronger note.




James Trafford, England, Czechia, Manchester City, Charlie Crew, Walsall, Wales

[1964white]

Welcome back, Matt.

[SG90]

I don't see why we'd get any money given we weren't in the league then.

[hector]

Welcome back, Matt.

Has he been somewhere??

[1964white]

Has he been somewhere??

Adam presented yesterday's breakfast debate thread.

[hector]

Adam presented yesterday's breakfast debate thread.

The transition was seamless.....

Well..... I never noticed......

[Jammy 07]

All the Man City chat and speculation is just boring me to tears now so please just get on with it and hand out the punishment.

[Bon]

Morning, and a wonderful one it is, just got confirmation of my scum ticket
Nothing anyone can do about the city debacle but let the powers that be get on with it now and kill em off quickly one way or another.

JT needs a run in the England set up, not a few small stand-ins then revert back to pickford, he also needs to sort his distribution out especially with his feet, he's very poor at the moment imho.
Still a very young inexperienced keeper with a lot of potential, glad we have him.

Hope Charlie Crews works out, he's a good player, we need to keep players like that for the future.

[DDB220]

Morning, and a wonderful one it is, just got confirmation of my scum ticket
Nothing anyone can do about the city debacle but let the powers that be get on with it now and kill em off quickly one way or another.

JT needs a run in the England set up, not a few small stand-ins then revert back to pickford, he also needs to sort his distribution out especially with his feet, he's very poor at the moment imho.
Still a very young inexperienced keeper with a lot of potential, glad we have him.

Hope Charlie Crews works out, he's a good player, we need to keep players like that for the future.

He perhaps could improve his distribution, but there are very very few keepers who can distribute the ball effectively and consistently when rapidly closed down and little time on the ball. The options for a keeper are the most difficult of any player position on the pitch in many regards. He cannot pass it back he either finds a player or leathers it long. In a confined hazardous part of the pitch it is not straight forward.

[1964white]

My mate Ges & his son often go watch Walsall.

Ges texted me a couple of weeks ago saying Charlie Crew looks distinctly average at League One level & there's no chance he would make it in the Premier League.

I've checked the Who Scored ratings & he has only achieved over 7/10 once in nine games for the Saddlers.

[Bon]

He perhaps could improve his distribution, but there are very very few keepers who can distribute the ball effectively and consistently when rapidly closed down and little time on the ball. The options for a keeper are the most difficult of any player position on the pitch in many regards. He cannot pass it back he either finds a player or leathers it long. In a confined hazardous part of the pitch it is not straight forward.

Keepers train every day, he should be improving his distribution already, he's a professional, free kick takers get better because they constantly practice, goalkeepers would get better if they did the same.
It's when he dithers on it, he's worse than Meslier ever was for that, someday he'll get caught out, nearly has already numerous times.

[weasel]

My mate Ges & his son often go watch Walsall.

Ges texted me a couple of weeks ago saying Charlie Crew looks distinctly average at League One level & there's no chance he would make it in the Premier League.

I've checked the Who Scored ratings & he has only achieved over 7/10 once in nine games for the Saddlers.

A shame but probably another one overhyped by the 'Why isn't Farke playing the youngsters' brigade.
Sadly our youth academy doesn't look to be in the best of shape with the only successes of recent times being Gray and Cresswell - however Archie would have likely have left long before he played for us if not for the Gray legacy and possibly Cresswell too might have only stayed long enough to break into the first team as his dad briefly played for us.

Likely any other kids to show standout talent were snapped up by the likes of City, who could offer the players/families bigger incentives.

[weasel]

Keepers train every day, he should be improving his distribution already, he's a professional, free kick takers get better because they constantly practice, goalkeepers would get better if they did the same.
It's when he dithers on it, he's worse than Meslier ever was for that, someday he'll get caught out, nearly has already numerous times.

My feeling is that because he has good distribution he doesn't just want to hoof it aimlessly and he 'dithers' as he is confident in his ability but waiting for the right pass to be on.

[SG90]

A shame but probably another one overhyped by the 'Why isn't Farke playing the youngsters' brigade.
Sadly our youth academy doesn't look to be in the best of shape with the only successes of recent times being Gray and Cresswell - however Archie would have likely have left long before he played for us if not for the Gray legacy and possibly Cresswell too might have only stayed long enough to break into the first team as his dad briefly played for us.

Likely any other kids to show standout talent were snapped up by the likes of City, who could offer the players/families bigger incentives.

He was bought from Cardiff, rather than from the academy. It just proves my point, we're wasting too much money on u21s who we're never going to play. Struijk and Jimmy were exceptions from like 50 players.

[Bon]

My feeling is that because he has good distribution he doesn't just want to hoof it aimlessly and he 'dithers' as he is confident in his ability but waiting for the right pass to be on.

Again though, a professional should'nt just "hoof it aimlessly" unless he's under pressure , imo professional footballers ought to be able to pick a pass and and it should reach it's intended target at least 8 times out of 10, am I expecting too much !!!
Not slating trafford btw, simply pointing out his major flaw.

[weasel]

He was bought from Cardiff, rather than from the academy. It just proves my point, we're wasting too much money on u21s who we're never going to play. Struijk and Jimmy were exceptions from like 50 players.

Paints the academy in an even poorer light.
Yeah like you say Struijk and Summerville were the 2 who made it out of the many that Orta bought. Gelhardt also, to a lesser degree, possibly Leif Davis though would have to check that he was brought in after Orta arrived. But also a lot of money wasted, Greenwood, Perkins spring to mind but also the various ex 'big club' players.

[1964white]

A shame but probably another one overhyped by the 'Why isn't Farke playing the youngsters' brigade.
Sadly our youth academy doesn't look to be in the best of shape with the only successes of recent times being Gray and Cresswell - however Archie would have likely have left long before he played for us if not for the Gray legacy and possibly Cresswell too might have only stayed long enough to break into the first team as his dad briefly played for us.

Likely any other kids to show standout talent were snapped up by the likes of City, who could offer the players/families bigger incentives.

It's a known fact in football many youngsters don't even get an opportunity to live their dreams as they struggle to make the step-up grade from junior to U18s football.

I suppose the lucky ones are footballers such as Crew who have enough talent to play professional football, be it at a lower level.

[The Subhuman]

You need the breaks, lots of very good footballers never get those, a lot of meh/average fotballers do and go on to have good careers. You have to find yourself at the right club at the right time with a good manager that believes in you.

So often we see a great player for whomever go to another club and just fail for one reason or another. (happens in all team sports)

There's a difference between talent and success, you don't have to have the former to get the latter. You frequently don't get the latter if you have the former.

We touch on this on the why is England so poor thread (paraphrased)

[DDB220]

Keepers train every day, he should be improving his distribution already, he's a professional, free kick takers get better because they constantly practice, goalkeepers would get better if they did the same.
It's when he dithers on it, he's worse than Meslier ever was for that, someday he'll get caught out, nearly has already numerous times.

It is hard to artificially create situations and distribution drills under the same pressure you will have during a match. There is no jeopardy on the training ground.

Anyone can take a free kick, what they produce is another matter. There is no comparison unless you are criticising his goal kicks, which I think are very solid.

The distribution moments when he was quickly closed down and his kicks were blocked were in one game. Let’s see if he repeats that before suggesting it is a flaw rather than over confidence.

[Ellandback1]

Welcome back, Matt.

Thanks Leon....