Archie Gray

[Cjay]

But it is a man who is willing to adapt to find success.
And you make it like it is something wrong to seek investment in your enterprise.

A rule of business, dont spend your own money when you can spend someone else's.



And a chancer would have took the Arsenal route during lockdown when it came to employee wages.

It's not perfect but it is no where near as bad as you like to think it is.

I don't agree with getting a venture capital fund involved in Leeds United, simple as that.

Don't like it, it highlights almost desperation on Radz part as that is who uses them, distressed sellers and underfunded start ups, its clear that it has caused issues since for us.

Credit to him for adapting maybe but it doesn't show a good plan and I don't think he always does what's best for the club over himself.

If we take him at his word then he has had loads of offers to invest in LUFC, why pick a venture capital fund? Best option for the club? Probably not , best option for Radz and staying in control?more likely.

Not the worst owner imaginable absolutely, but far from the best either.

We did take government money tbf, didn't sack anyone but still not not good look (with other clubs)

Tbh I think people would have a slightly less harsh view of our ownership if the 3 main ones were more likeable.

But they aren't.

Orta is Orta.

Radz has this habit of making ludicrous claims or ranting on twitter.

And Kinnear is ever so smarmy and talks down in his notes.

If we stay up and they leave us in a better place AND the 49ers aren't the nightmare they could be then credit to the 3.

But it's touch and go.

[Cjay]

Anyhow

Archie

[Irish Ian]

Thought Archie had done something and it was being discussed when saw his thread bumped

But no.

The board aren't villains like some.

But they are chancers.

Highlighted by The fact within 6 months of taking over Radz had to go to a Venture Capital fund because he had underestimated the finance needed.

That isn't a man with a plan.

Everything is a That'll do attitude.

Hope for the best, keep costs low as possible.

Everything done on a wing and a prayer

They have elements of Cellino and Bates whilst not being quite as bad as the worst of the pair.

Villa owned by a private equity company

Bet you would live their commitment.

[Cjay]

Villa owned by a private equity company

Bet you would live their commitment.

Not the same as a venture capital fund.

But yes they have invested absolute massive amounts of money.

I'd be very happy with that

Not comparable though.

For a start Radz would never have approached them, Private Equity funds always want a majority ownership.

Hence my point about I don't think Radz always does what's best for the club.

He has hung on to long.

[Irish Ian]

Not the same as a venture capital fund.

But yes they have invested absolute massive amounts of money.

I'd be very happy with that

Not comparable though.

For a start Radz would never have approached them, Private Equity funds always want a majority ownership.

Hence my point about I don't think Radz always does what's best for the club.

He has hung on to long.

So once 49ers take over you can call them PE instead of VC... but it makes no difference/



The goal is the same Make a profit.

There are essentially two types of owners in Football.

1.The vanity owners who are happy to be associated and will keep the club afloat by continual personal investment

2. The investors ( call them what you like) who seek a financial gain on their return.

Villa owners are in which category? The fact that they have now branched out into taking a controlling share in Vitoria in Portugal highlights that Villa are not a vanity project but a serious finacial investment from which they will expect to make money.

Just like we see with the SF crowd, Leeds will be one assest among many and as long as we see then trying to grow their investment
Just like we see with Fenway at Liverpool

Also the fact that 49ers have an agreement to take control of Leeds actually means that you can drop your description of VC

[Cjay]

So once 49ers take over you can call them PE instead of VC... but it makes no difference/



The goal is the same Make a profit.

There are essentially two types of owners in Football.

1.The vanity owners who are happy to be associated and will keep the club afloat by continual personal investment

2. The investors ( call them what you like) who seek a financial gain on their return.

Villa owners are in which category? The fact that they have now branched out into taking a controlling share in Vitoria in Portugal highlights that Villa are not a vanity project but a serious finacial investment from which they will expect to make money.

Just like we see with the SF crowd, Leeds will be one assest among many and as long as we see then trying to grow their investment
Just like we see with Fenway at Liverpool

Also the fact that 49ers have an agreement to take control of Leeds actually means that you can drop your description of VC

The Villa owners are funded by 2 very rich people who have invested absolute fortunes (nearly £500million) into Villa with the intention of growing them ultimately to make a profit as you say.

They intend on using Villa as the top club in there multi club plan (similar to Man City and the City Group).

Radz has expressed similar aims but obviously has nowhere near the financial muscle.

The difference between them and the 49ers is that Villa owners are using there own money.

They don't need to raise capital through investors because they have it.

49ers taking control of us would be odd because that isn't generally what venture capital funds do.

So hopefully that means they have managed to gather far wealthier investors. Does that make them a private equity firm? I don't know, no expert.

From what I can gather Private Equity firms tend to have far more financial power because they tend to invest in more established businesses rather than startups or distressed sellers.

But it's not a strategy I like given the amount of teams who have succeeded under similar investments without an already established major commercial income is 0.

Venture Capital funds by there very nature rarely invest capital (because they have to justify raising the funds to investors) not an easy thing to do.

We as a club can't progress without significant capital investment in the short term.

49ers will need to buck the trend in terms of finance.

Hopefully they do

[andrewjohnsmith]

THIS IS THE ARCHIE GRAY THREAD

Archie played 65 minutes for the 23's today. Yesterday he was trusted on the bench ahead of Gyabi - who is obviously more match fit.

With a 2 week break, we might see him making a 1st team appearance soon.

[Irish Ian]

The Villa owners are funded by 2 very rich people who have invested absolute fortunes (nearly £500million) into Villa with the intention of growing them ultimately to make a profit as you say.

They intend on using Villa as the top club in there multi club plan (similar to Man City and the City Group).

Radz has expressed similar aims but obviously has nowhere near the financial muscle.

The difference between them and the 49ers is that Villa owners are using there own money.

They don't need to raise capital through investors because they have it.

49ers taking control of us would be odd because that isn't generally what venture capital funds do.

So hopefully that means they have managed to gather far wealthier investors. Does that make them a private equity firm? I don't know, no expert.

From what I can gather Private Equity firms tend to have far more financial power because they tend to invest in more established businesses rather than startups or distressed sellers.

But it's not a strategy I like given the amount of teams who have succeeded under similar investments without an already established major commercial income is 0.

Venture Capital funds by there very nature rarely invest capital (because they have to justify raising the funds to investors) not an easy thing to do.

We as a club can't progress without significant capital investment in the short term.

49ers will need to buck the trend in terms of finance.

Hopefully they do

Their own money comes from their business how can't you see that? It's not like they have £3B sitting in their current account. They arent spending personal wealth.

Going forward there is also a further issue.

We have the Lowy factor, net worth when they start pumping megabucks into the club would it make you happy?

Finally what investor would turn down 20% because that is what the studies suggest can be the return on a cany investment in a elite European club.

Buy Archie a nice shiny pair of boots?

[Cjay]

Their own money comes from their business how can't you see that? It's not like they have £3B sitting in their current account. They arent spending personal wealth.

Going forward there is also a further issue.

We have the Lowy factor, net worth when they start pumping megabucks into the club would it make you happy?

Finally what investor would turn down 20% because that is what the studies suggest can be the return on a cany investment in a elite European club.

Buy Archie a nice shiny pair of boots?

It's still there money is the point, the Egyptian owner of Villa is phenomenally wealthy and owns stakes in multiple multi billion pound companies (including Adidas).

Lowy would need his old man's permission I'd assume given its his money really. And people who know about the Lowy family say they are famously tight and only see LUFC as a hobby.

Hopefully they step up but not sure myself.

Will be more confident when we know who the investors are.

If its a collection of small millionaire investors not much will change, a collection of billionaires then maybe.

But till we know what exactly the 49ers aim is we can't be sure.

Anyway

Wonder if Archie has started taking driving lessons

[Victor_OTT_17]

The future is bright: the future is Archie Gray https://www.leedsallover.com/watch-leed ... uth-today/

[Cjay]

His breakthrough season next season?

[Chilli D]

He can't fail with those genes.

[Cjay]

Well done young man.

Did a good job today

Very tidy on the ball, not afraid to put a tackle in.

Important not to ask him to do more than he should at his age

But a very decent option.

[Prisoner37]

Archie has really shown his potential during pre-season but at this stage he needs to be managed rather than being relied upon.

Given his pedigree he is someone that the future can be built around.

[Leeds1000]

He's got a real competitive streak with i like. Still very raw in the tackle but the kid will get his chance this season.

[billysboots]

Archie has really shown his potential during pre-season but at this stage he needs to be managed rather than being relied upon.

Given his pedigree he is someone that the future can be built around.

Spot on.

[1964white]

A mature head on young shoulders, he is way ahead of his U21 teammates.

Archie has natural ability, it's in his genes of course.

[geronimo]

a future star in the making but unfortunately it will be a case of how long Leeds can keep hold of him before the big hitters begin to circle once again should be a nice earner for the owners in the long term. We have always had a great record of discovering future talent the problem as always been that they don't last too long playing in a Leeds shirt

[Finnatic]

a future star in the making but unfortunately it will be a case of how long Leeds can keep hold of him before the big hitters begin to circle once again should be a nice earner for the owners in the long term. We have always had a great record of discovering future talent the problem as always been that they don't last too long playing in a Leeds shirt

It’s like that for 95% of all professional football clubs in the world, that’s just how it is.
Enjoy them while you can.

[geronimo]

It’s like that for 95% of all professional football clubs in the world, that’s just how it is.
Enjoy them while you can.

I think you would find that if we were a premier League club who were in and around the top six regularly which for a club the size of Leeds would be the minimum target we would find ourselves in a far stronger bargaining position than been in the championship once again and been run by owners who cannot even command a decent transfer fee based on a players ability and future potential it would certainly extend Gray's career at Leeds as it stands if Gray's career blossoms then he is almost certainly to be gone within the next two to three years