Leeds Utd v Watford Match Thread

[CypriotWhite]

Not jumping on Piroe, however he lacks the pace to play as a centre forward and that's just a fact. Everyone can see it and how it affects the way we play the ball forward to stretch the opposition defence without losing possession.

A decent player but probably a poor mans Harry Kane, who's another player who attracts debate about his overall game and whether a team will win more games (and trophies) without him.

Nailed, especially the Kane bit.
He needs others to do the dirty work for him.
On the + side, that is what the manager is working towards.

[DDB220]

Has Piroe scored a hattrick for Leeds?

As for Rodon, the reason he's receiving votes is that apart from his error for their goal, he made two important tackles & seven dominant defensive headed clearances, plus two clearances with his boots.

If Rodon didn't start, we miss him big-time.

We don't miss Piroe when he starts.

Back to his super-sub role for Joel on Saturday, that's when we get the best out of him.

I think the attacker who skinned Struijk with Firpo also chasing his tail showed some good quality, strength and pace. The ball into the middle could have gone anywhere, it just fell kindly for one of theirs after Rodon put a block on the cross. The key factor to this goal was the dude getting in behind.

We did not defend well on the flanks last night. They were looking to exploit that avenue frequently.

[CypriotWhite]

Made the point vs Sheffield United as did others tbf he tried to run in behind often, could see him pointing and making the run.

Ball never came.

You don't need pace to be a striker, just a good brain which he has.

If he was a bad player I'd say trust me, but he isn't, and the club and Farke can't think he is because why sign him?

He would get 25+ goals this season played upfront.

Him and the scarecrow from the Wizard of Oz could be twins, it's the one thing he's most definitely lacking - Intelligence.
Bamford has it, but can't finish and is a skiver.
Joseph has it, but is currently suffering from barndooritis.
They all have differing attributes, they will all play their part this season, the manager is expertly managing them all with commonsense.

[CypriotWhite]

Has anyone mentioned Pascal was responsible for their goal yet, when he hoofed it up field instead of keeping possession and playing it out from the back, consequently leading to their goal?

[CUSSIE01]

I’d put money on Piroe scoring the Joseph chance last night, I like the work rate Joseph puts in and he’ll score some goals but Joel is a proven goal scorer who’ll put more chances away. I’d start with James & Piroe on Saturday with Gnonto on the left, Dan is a very clever player and sees more of what’s happening ahead of him and will create more for Piroe while Gnonto will shoot every chance he gets rather than pass ( not a bad thing at times ). I still think Joseph is more effective off the bench with his pace than Piroe, just my humble opinion.
If only DF joined the forum we’d win the league at a canter

[The Subhuman]

If it's either/or I would start Joseph every time. He just brings a lot more to the party. For me, he has the better first touch, he drags defenders out of position, presses better, holds the ball up better, his pace has to be accounted for and he passes with vision.

[mentalcase]

Has anyone mentioned Pascal was responsible for their goal yet, when he hoofed it up field instead of keeping possession and playing it out from the back, consequently leading to their goal?

I don't call covering for that clown of a LB as at fault, if firpo had been where he was meant to be, not galavanting upfield leaving massive gaps for the opposition to exploit every game, Struijk would have been able to cover him, not the other way round.
Sure Pascal got skinned, but as I say, he ought to have been just there to cover firpos arse.
Both Firpo and Bogle are liabilities at times. more often than not Firpo, maybe it's the way the gaffer wants us to play, leaves us wide open far too often for my liking, the PL minnows will be all over that never mind the big boys.

[1964white]

I think the attacker who skinned Struijk with Firpo also chasing his tail showed some good quality, strength and pace. The ball into the middle could have gone anywhere, it just fell kindly for one of theirs after Rodon put a block on the cross. The key factor to this goal was the dude getting in behind.

We did not defend well on the flanks last night. They were looking to exploit that avenue frequently.

I agree, Struijk & Firpo got done for pace, similar to one of the goals conceded at Sunderland.

Didn't the ball just hit Rodon as it was fired into the ball?

[The Subhuman]

Has anyone mentioned Pascal was responsible for their goal yet, when he hoofed it up field instead of keeping possession and playing it out from the back, consequently leading to their goal?

You're kidding right?

1. It wasn't a hoof it was a measured ball out
2. It found it's man (completed pass) and we could easily have launched an attack at that point

I'm guessing you were fuming with that pass that ended up on Firpo's foot leading to the first goal..

Pascal may have been culpable for allowing Baah to beat him outside but Baah is quick and strong and I'd prefer to credit him with a good goal than look at any small error

[1964white]

I’d put money on Piroe scoring the Joseph chance last night, I like the work rate Joseph puts in and he’ll score some goals but Joel is a proven goal scorer who’ll put more chances away. I’d start with James & Piroe on Saturday with Gnonto on the left, Dan is a very clever player and sees more of what’s happening ahead of him and will create more for Piroe while Gnonto will shoot every chance he gets rather than pass ( not a bad thing at times ). I still think Joseph is more effective off the bench with his pace than Piroe, just my humble opinion.
If only DF joined the forum we’d win the league at a canter

Piroe also missed a sitter too!

Three of Piroe's four goals have occurred when he's come off the bench.

We had no control for long periods of that match last night, because the pressing was poor, Aaronson can't do it on his own whilst Piroe aimlessly strolls around.

[1964white]

If it's either/or I would start Joseph every time. He just brings a lot more to the party. For me, he has the better first touch, he drags defenders out of position, presses better, holds the ball up better, his pace has to be accounted for and he passes with vision.

And the young man does it very well.

Joseph is the right type of No.9 required to play in the hustle & bustle that the championship is.

[The Subhuman]

Piroe also missed a sitter too!

Three of Piroe's four goals have occurred when he's come off the bench.

We had no control for long periods of that match last night, because the pressing was poor, Aaronson can't do it on his own whilst Piroe aimlessly strolls around.

Which would suggest he's good when defenders tire and space opens up.

[1964white]

Which would suggest he's good when defenders tire and space opens up.

I've made the same comment about Piroe several times.

[weasel]

Indeed Ian

Let the Farke knockers have their moments.

Blimey! we are top of the league.

The correct term is Dannybashers

[1964white]

Even though Watford only had two shots on target, the hornets were the best team we've faced this season, unsure they'll make the play-offs though as they have lost four of their last six games.

Watford's No.8 Giorgi Chakvetadze looked a decent player.

The return fixture will be a tough encounter for us!

[weasel]

Joseph and James came on vs tired legs who had no choice but to push forward so were allowed space.

The idea Piroe is best off the bench doesn't fit in with his Championship record, neither does the idea he needs space because as I said to you last night his Swansea team had a higher average possession in both seasons than we have had.

So it would suggest he is perfectly comfortable playing against packed defences.

People see what they want to see, last season it was "Piroe doesn't provide what Bamford does".

Actually the data says he does, he's better at pressing than Bamford was for Bielsa, won more tackles, recoveries etc but he doesn't run around manically which appeals to the English fan so it goes unnoticed.

Things he does go unnoticed, Struijk goal vs Blunts, it was Piroe run that created the space.

The pass to Joseph, had that been Joseph passing it as Weasel said would have been mass creaming on here, barely a mention for JP.

Was Piroe running in that likely caught the Watford goalies eye for the 1st goal.

He makes runs all the time that because of the style the ball never comes so he never gets credit for them.

He had a poor game yesterday but he also played a lovely 1st time pass to Gnonto who should do better.

Missed a poor chance but the one Joseph missed was worse, he also took a free header off Aaronson.

But he just gets praised for running around.

He earned his start, he earned the right to keep his place with his performance vs Blunts.

And if we dropped a player for one bad game then we'd be making multiple changes every week.

He's judged far harsher than many on here just like Ali was.

I'm happy to call out his poor performances, but the overreaction on here and claiming one of the best Championship strikers of the last few years (Yes the data backs that up its why we signed him) is a bench player at best is ridiculous.

I think you will find that I said if it had been Pablo playing that pass the cream explosion would have occured.

Apart from that I am fairly much in agreement.It is like Piroe is not allowed to miss a chance. The chance last ngiht was made harder because it ran away from Gnonto rather than it being passed to him so Piroe was hitting it and likely half expecting Gnonto to be swinging his foot at it too so he wasn't ever going to be striking it as cleanly as if it had been passed to him. If he scores that then people would have said he had a decent game and ultimately that is what strikers are judged on.

I think we should just be glad that we have both Piroe and Joseph and also hopefully Bamford can get back to the same level of fitness that he got to last season and can have one of his streaky runs of goals. I think all three will have a part to play this season and all three can blow hot and cold, like Jaydog chewing on a mint (whilst performing sexual favours obviously - it should go without saying but sometimes I fear I am too subtle).

[weasel]

Even though Watford only had two shots on target, the hornets were the best team we've faced this season, unsure they'll make the play-offs though as they have lost four of their last six games.

Watford's No.8 Giorgi Chakvetadze looked a decent player.

The return fixture will be a tough encounter for us!

I wouldn't go over the top with praise for them although they did look like they should be doing better than they are. I suspect that the circumstnaces of the match dictated how they played rather than tactics. I think at 2-0 they were shellshocked and any gameplan they had went out of the window. Chances are that in the two injury breaks for Largey they (the Watford players and managers) decided they had nothing to lose by trying to take the game to us. If it hadn't been for our early goals and the two injury breaks in play then I think Watford would have played like most teams do against us and simply parked the bus.

I think Watford could be a tough proposition in the return fixture but the same can be said for a lot of championship teams. We have seen many teams in the championship go on good runs and be a real tough opponent yet at other times of the season they play sh*t. The likes of Sunderland may well just be having a decent run but may well fade into mid table. Most championship side have a few decent players and can look good on their day. As it was we allowed them to throw all they had at us and yet they hardly laid a glove on us - indeed if we'd had our shooting boots we could have had 4 or 5 goals in the second half alone.

[Jammy 07]

the hornets were the best team we've faced this season

Not for me 64.

They were pretty woeful defensively as shown by how many chances we created. Also I'm pretty sure if Ramazani hadn't had to go off injured we'd have beaten them comfortably. Attacking wise they were better but still Meslier had a fairly quiet evening with barely anything to save. Seems to me we made them look better by not stretching the pitch second half and once that was rectified (by Joseph and James coming on) we were fairly comfortable with quite a few excellent chances to increase our advantage.

Best opponent at ER this season I'd say were Burnley as they were dangerous on the counter attack and once they'd taken the lead were comfortably able to shut up shop and see the game out. Away from home is more difficult to judge from just watching on TV but so far none of our opponents have impressed me that much so overall the team I'd place 2nd most difficult would be Sheff Utd as they are an incredibly solid outfit and will finish right up there somewhere.

[1964white]

Not for me 64.

They were pretty woeful defensively as shown by how many chances we created. Also I'm pretty sure if Ramazani hadn't had to go off injured we'd have beaten them comfortably. Attacking wise they were better, but still Meslier had a fairly quiet evening with barely anything to save. Seems to me we made them look better by not stretching the pitch second half and once that was rectified (by Joseph and James coming on) we were fairly comfortable with quite a few excellent chances to increase our advantage.

Best opponent at ER this season I'd say were Burnley as they were dangerous on the counter attack and once they'd taken the lead were comfortably able to shut up shop and see the game out. Away from home is more difficult to judge from just watching on TV but so far none of our opponents have impressed me that much. Overall the team that I'd place 2nd most difficult so far would be Sheff Utd as they are an incredibly solid outfit and will finish right up there somewhere.

We did go to pieces after Ranazani's injury.

You may be right Jammy, as I'm pretty sure Burnley & the Blunts will be our closest challengers.

I just think the physicality of Watford gave us more problems than the teams we faced this season.

[1964white]

I wouldn't go over the top with praise for them although they did look like they should be doing better than they are. I suspect that the circumstnaces of the match dictated how they played rather than tactics. I think at 2-0 they were shellshocked and any gameplan they had went out of the window. Chances are that in the two injury breaks for Largey they (the Watford players and managers) decided they had nothing to lose by trying to take the game to us. If it hadn't been for our early goals and the two injury breaks in play then I think Watford would have played like most teams do against us and simply parked the bus.

I think Watford could be a tough proposition in the return fixture but the same can be said for a lot of championship teams. We have seen many teams in the championship go on good runs and be a real tough opponent yet at other times of the season they play sh*t. The likes of Sunderland may well just be having a decent run but may well fade into mid table. Most championship side have a few decent players and can look good on their day. As it was we allowed them to throw all they had at us and yet they hardly laid a glove on us - indeed if we'd had our shooting boots we could have had 4 or 5 goals in the second half alone.

After my comments about the hornets, I don't think Watford will make the play-offs.